LOC Bruiser EXP recovery question

LOC Bruiser EXP recovery question

Post by Mark A Palme » Fri, 13 Dec 2002 02:27:08



Quote:

> Also (again in places like Kansas) the
> high wind will drag  a rocket with a big chute along the ground or thru those
> afore mentioned furrows and shred it worse than almost any normal landing
> would.

I had quite an experience this weekend with a 16 lb. 5.5 inch Standard ARM. Flew it
1200 ft on a Pro38 6 grain J330. Used a drogue less descent to 600 feet and
deployed an 84 inch round chute. Landed about 300 yards away from the pad. The wind
dragged the rocket about 1/2 a mile on the ground in a serpentine pattern. Launched
it from a corn field (well Furrowed) but landed in a bean field (flat and wide
open). I was told it was a rather funny thing to watch And if it had been taped, it
should have been submitted to America's Funniest Home Video's. As I would approach
the rocket it would accelerate away from me at a speed I couldn't quite match. When
i finally caught and tackled the rocket, both tube sections were filled with snow
and ice scooped up on it's journey. Ant the forward end of the booster section
looks as though someone took a belt sander to the lip. I would have thought that
with all that fin area it would have dug in sooner or later. It was the perfect
chute for the bird.....until it landed of course.

Mark A Palmer

TRA 08542, L2

 
 
 

LOC Bruiser EXP recovery question

Post by Duane Wilk » Fri, 13 Dec 2002 09:48:28


So what if I think I have two TRA numbers? ( shut up no you don't - oh be quiet
, yes you do) All that means is I pay double dues and don't get twice the
issues of HPR deleivered to me. SO there!

Duane ( Duane) WIlkey (Wilkey)
Duane Wilkey
Blastoff Rocket CLub of Erie
HPR Advisor
NAR 63416 TRA 4295  - L3
NAR L3CC Member

 
 
 

LOC Bruiser EXP recovery question

Post by Duane Wilk » Fri, 13 Dec 2002 09:55:16


Hi Lloyd,

I know you slow your rockets down to prevent damage to your paint jobs. Me ,
have krylon will travel.

As to Kanas, yup, I'll be going, I have a level 3 cert candidate that wants to
do his flight there.

As to the blankets vs. deployment bag issue - Whatever prevents the chute from
getting toasted works for me.

Shroud lines are a different matter. I've found that the silicon ***d
chutes ( Rocketman/B2) work with both a single wrap or no wrap ( if no wrap
they better be in a deployment bag) I played with your configuration all last
season and didn't see much difference in deployment, but the single wrap did
make packing easier.

Normal rip-stop might not work as nicely in reguards to the single wrap.

Duane Wilkey
Blastoff Rocket CLub of Erie
HPR Advisor
NAR 63416 TRA 4295  - L3
NAR L3CC Member

 
 
 

LOC Bruiser EXP recovery question

Post by Bob Kapl » Fri, 13 Dec 2002 09:47:16


Quote:

> So what if I think I have two TRA numbers? ( shut up no you don't - oh be quiet
> , yes you do) All that means is I pay double dues and don't get twice the
> issues of HPR deleivered to me. SO there!

But then you've missed twice as many issues too...

        Bob Kaplow      NAR # 18L       TRA # "Impeach the TRA BoD"
                >>> To reply, remove the TRABoD! <<<
Kaplow Klips & Baffle:      http://www.FoundCollection.com/
    www.encompasserve.org/~kaplow_r/    www.nira-rocketry.org    www.nar.org

        26-October, 2001: A day that will live in infamy
        Support Freedom: http://www.FoundCollection.com/

        "I tell you, freedom and human rights in America are doomed.
        The U.S. government will lead the American people in and the
        West in general into an unbearable hell and a *** life."

 
 
 

LOC Bruiser EXP recovery question

Post by Davi » Fri, 13 Dec 2002 12:10:09


I don't know what you mean by "single wrap".  What are you wrapping around
what?

-- David

Quote:
> Hi Lloyd,

> I know you slow your rockets down to prevent damage to your paint jobs. Me
,
> have krylon will travel.

> As to Kanas, yup, I'll be going, I have a level 3 cert candidate that
wants to
> do his flight there.

> As to the blankets vs. deployment bag issue - Whatever prevents the chute
from
> getting toasted works for me.

> Shroud lines are a different matter. I've found that the silicon
***d
> chutes ( Rocketman/B2) work with both a single wrap or no wrap ( if no
wrap
> they better be in a deployment bag) I played with your configuration all
last
> season and didn't see much difference in deployment, but the single wrap
did
> make packing easier.

> Normal rip-stop might not work as nicely in reguards to the single wrap.

> Duane Wilkey
> Blastoff Rocket CLub of Erie
> HPR Advisor
> NAR 63416 TRA 4295  - L3
> NAR L3CC Member

 
 
 

LOC Bruiser EXP recovery question

Post by Duane Wilk » Fri, 13 Dec 2002 13:02:58


Quote:
>ubject: Re: LOC Bruiser EXP recovery question

>I don't know what you mean by "single wrap".  What are you wrapping around
>what?

A single wrap of the shroud lines around the folded canopy.

Duane Wilkey
Blastoff Rocket CLub of Erie
HPR Advisor
NAR 63416 TRA 4295  - L3
NAR L3CC Member

 
 
 

LOC Bruiser EXP recovery question

Post by Actionxp » Fri, 13 Dec 2002 17:40:42


Duane
It IS difficult to match that green and tan paint job I use on most of my
rockets. That's why I like to bring them in softly:-).  As to the one wrap or
no wrap.....now I know why you didn't see any benefits! I fold my chutes and
roll them VERY tightly. I then wrap the lines COMPLETELY around the chute
(right to the quick link). This keeps the chute in a tight "ball."  When the
nose pulls the chute (and blanket) out, the blanket opens up, the lines unroll
and the chute almost explodes open. I've used this method, for years, on both
Rocketman and LOC chutes and NEVER had one not open or get tangled. I use a
blanket that is as big as I can (Ky's 30 inchers on a 7.5 inch tube). I put the
shock cord and the chute ball inside and fold the circle from 4 sides. I also
use a short piece of Kevlar to connect this to the nose/payload and main body.
As I said It has worked for me.
 For anyone that wants to see what I mean..try this. Take a Rocketman Chute and
stretch it out on the floor. Next, fold the chute along its four main seams.
You should now have one panel that is flat on one side and curved on the other.
Next, fold this panel over on itself until you have a fairly thin and square
line. Next, roll this up into a tight roll, making sure that the material
doesn't squeeze out the sides ( NOT real easy to do!). Next, tightly wrap the
shroud lines around this roll, right up to the quick link. Now, take it out
side, hold on to the quick link and pitch the roll away from you (under handed,
like a soft ball pitch) I think you'll see what I mean. For chutes that use
less slipery material than Ky's this method may not work as well, but, as I
mentioned, I've used it on the biggest LOC chutes, too.
 While I think deployment bags certainly have their place (and are absolutely
necessary on Pyro release type setups or any setup where the nose comes down
seperately. I'll certainly use one on my V-2) I'm not happy using them on
"normal" setups. Lots of people love them, but, for me, the necessity of having
to pull the bag off the chute, cord and shroud lines just adds to the
complexity. The blanket setup opens on it's own and I've never had the laundry
stay in the blanket.
 The only problem I ever did have with one of Ky's chutes was when I took HIS
advice and packed the chute loosely, in my Warloc. The nose blew off, the
shroud lines extended, and the chute stayed in the tube. The rocket fell about
1500 feet, at which point the chute finally came out (at about 500 ft) opened
and landed right next to the pad! I spent the rest of the weekend (at the last
NSL in Muncie) answering questions about my "special" delayed deployment
system. I told people that it was still in the "development stage" and wasn't
very reliable, yet:-). One vote for blankets!
 We'll keep in touch on LDRS. Maybe we can convoy, again. Talk to you, soon.

            Lloyd Wood
            BRS Secretary
            Level lll

 
 
 

LOC Bruiser EXP recovery question

Post by Kurt Kesle » Fri, 13 Dec 2002 23:50:59




Quote:
>  While I think deployment bags certainly have their place (and are absolutely
> necessary on Pyro release type setups or any setup where the nose comes down
> seperately. I'll certainly use one on my V-2) I'm not happy using them on
> "normal" setups. Lots of people love them, but, for me, the necessity of having
> to pull the bag off the chute, cord and shroud lines just adds to the
> complexity. The blanket setup opens on it's own and I've never had the laundry
> stay in the blanket.

Since I figured out deployment bags I have found them to be more
reliable, even for single deployment rockets using motor ejection.

--
Kurt Kesler

 
 
 

LOC Bruiser EXP recovery question

Post by Mark Simps » Sat, 14 Dec 2002 02:27:26


Quote:

> Duane
> It IS difficult to match that green and tan paint job I use on most of my
> rockets. That's why I like to bring them in softly:-).  As to the one wrap or
> no wrap.....now I know why you didn't see any benefits! I fold my chutes and
> roll them VERY tightly. I then wrap the lines COMPLETELY around the chute
> (right to the quick link). This keeps the chute in a tight "ball."  When the
> nose pulls the chute (and blanket) out, the blanket opens up, the lines unroll
> and the chute almost explodes open. I've used this method, for years, on both
> Rocketman and LOC chutes and NEVER had one not open or get tangled. I use a
> blanket that is as big as I can (Ky's 30 inchers on a 7.5 inch tube). I put the
> shock cord and the chute ball inside and fold the circle from 4 sides. I also
> use a short piece of Kevlar to connect this to the nose/payload and main body.
> As I said It has worked for me.

I used to wrap my shroud lines around the chute until one of my
Woodies (at a NYPOWER, in fact) failed to unfurl even after having
successfully exited the body tube. As I began to lift up the shock
cord to repack the rocket, the chute unrolled on the ground. Darndest
thing that I've ever seen.  But since that day, I NEVER wrap any
shroud lines around my chutes. I fold them inside of the chute.

On a side note to Lloyd:
My son has my winter car maintenance tasks all planned out: ported
heads and manifold, long-tube headers, high stall torque convertor and
cam in a cold, crowded garage.  He wants to break into the 11's with
his '94 Z28 this coming summer.  Lucky for me, he'll be going away to
college NEXT fall or we'd be doing a supercharger. ;-)

Mark Simpson
NAR 71503 Level II

 
 
 

LOC Bruiser EXP recovery question

Post by Duane Wilk » Sat, 14 Dec 2002 03:01:11


Hi Lloyd,

THe reason I probably haven't seen any marked improvement in performance is
because I use a deployment bag. The chute is the last thing to be pulled from
the bag so I'd guess that it really doesn't matter with this type of set-up.

I've used blankets and they work, but Istill prefer the 100% no-goof protection
a d-bag provides.

The only thing you have to careful of when using a deployment bag set-up is
that the forward section/nosecone have enough mass to provide the interial
moment to pull everthing clear of the containment tube.

The time I've ever had problems with a d-bag is when I use it conjuction with a
light n/c like a 4" ACE.  THose cones don't have enough mass to do the job
unless htey're backed up by an overly large ejection event .( 5 grams in a 30"
section of 4" tube anything less and no joy)

Take Care,

Duane
Duane Wilkey
Blastoff Rocket CLub of Erie
HPR Advisor
NAR 63416 TRA 4295  - L3
NAR L3CC Member

 
 
 

LOC Bruiser EXP recovery question

Post by Kurt Kesle » Sat, 14 Dec 2002 03:20:08




Quote:
> Hi Lloyd,

> THe reason I probably haven't seen any marked improvement in performance is
> because I use a deployment bag. The chute is the last thing to be pulled from
> the bag so I'd guess that it really doesn't matter with this type of set-up.

Anybody else remember high school where there was a group of people, you
tried to enter the conversation, and were markedly ignored?  It's like
deja vu all over again.

Guess I'm in the wrong "clique".  I'll go back to the bandroom now ;-)

--
Kurt Kesler

 
 
 

LOC Bruiser EXP recovery question

Post by Duane Wilk » Sat, 14 Dec 2002 06:11:20


You>Anybody else remember high school where there was a group of people, you

Quote:
>tried to enter the conversation, and were markedly ignored?  It's like
>deja vu all over again.

>Guess I'm in the wrong "clique".  I'll go back to the bandroom now ;-)

>--
>Kurt Kesler

You can't hide there Kurt, it was one of my most favorite hang-outs. ( 1st
chair bassonist 74-78)

Duane Wilkey
Blastoff Rocket CLub of Erie
HPR Advisor
NAR 63416 TRA 4295  - L3
NAR L3CC Member

 
 
 

LOC Bruiser EXP recovery question

Post by Hilty Information Syste » Sat, 14 Dec 2002 06:24:59



Quote:
>You>Anybody else remember high school where there was a group of people, you
>>tried to enter the conversation, and were markedly ignored?  It's like
>>deja vu all over again.

>>Guess I'm in the wrong "clique".  I'll go back to the bandroom now ;-)

>>--
>>Kurt Kesler

>You can't hide there Kurt, it was one of my most favorite hang-outs. ( 1st
>chair bassonist 74-78)

Q: Why did the chicken cross the road?
A: To get away from the bassoon recital.

Top ten reasons to play bassoon:
    10. Sightreading is so much easier.
    9. You can play as loud as you want; nobody hears you anyway.
    8. Tons of solos.
    7.*** out with the bass clarinetist.
    6. There's so little competition.
    5. It's an excellent excuse to get out of marching band.
    4. It's easier to tongue than on a flute.
    3. That pleasant "new reed" feeling.
    2. Showing up the trombones.
    1. There are so few bassoon jokes.

<vbg>

Tod "First chair "Tubaissimo"  79-81" Hilty

Tod A. Hilty  NAR #72099
Hilty Information Systems

  - replace ihrUnterhose with adelphia for reply
--
Member MTMA, NAR Section #606  

Mantua Township Missile Agency
http://www.FoundCollection.com/~markndeb/rockets/mtma/

"I'm going to put the wheels of the bus back on... just in case"
   - BlankReg, Max Headroom: 20 Minutes Into the Future

"I speak for myself _and_ my corporation!  Deal with it!"
   - blankreg

 
 
 

LOC Bruiser EXP recovery question

Post by Kurt Kesle » Sat, 14 Dec 2002 06:34:28




Quote:
> You>Anybody else remember high school where there was a group of people, you
> >tried to enter the conversation, and were markedly ignored?  It's like
> >deja vu all over again.

> >Guess I'm in the wrong "clique".  I'll go back to the bandroom now ;-)

> >--
> >Kurt Kesler

> You can't hide there Kurt, it was one of my most favorite hang-outs. ( 1st
> chair bassonist 74-78)

> Duane Wilkey

Bassoon?  How on earth did you march with that? ;-)

I played alto sax through HS and 2 years of college.  Now I don't even
know where the silly thing is.
--
Kurt Kesler

 
 
 

LOC Bruiser EXP recovery question

Post by Duane Wilk » Sat, 14 Dec 2002 10:14:58


Hi Gang ;

The worst part about playing a basson was if other band members saw a score
that had the various parts written in Italian.

Bassoon = ***to ( From the Latin ***, meaning bundle of sticks)

Think about High School and you know where this has just got to lead...

I've heard all the jokes, so don't even bother. ;-)
Duane Wilkey
Blastoff Rocket CLub of Erie
HPR Advisor
NAR 63416 TRA 4295  - L3
NAR L3CC Member