LOC Onyx advice

LOC Onyx advice

Post by Woody Mille » Sat, 20 May 2000 04:00:00



Quote:

> Just picked up an LOC Onyx kit.  First LOC kit I've seen without TTW fins.
> Any advice / tips from those who've built these before?

> Thanks,

> Rob
> --
> You'll have to remove the nonsense from
> my email address to use it...
> ****************

Epoxy rivets for the fins..  Drill holes in the bt where the fins go, and drill
a few small holes in the root edge of the fins. Rough up the BT where the
fins/fillets go with sandpaper and use good sized fillets for the fins..

Launched mine on stuff up thru a G64, and the only problem I've had was not at a
launch..  My cat knocked it off the counter, and then pounced on it (a CAT-O).

I'm finishing up a Loc Litl' Nuke which has the same style fins, and may add
some glass over the fillets, but I'm planning to fly it on H's (my first Litl'
Nuke was also built this way, and I've flown it 20-30 times on F40's, but had
built it with an upper thrust ring, which restricts me to consumer reloads - it
was my 2nd MPR, and at the time, I didn't think I'd fly anything bigger than a
consumer G...)
--
Woody Miller
NAR 74701 Sr L2
SSS
EARS
----------------------------------------------------------------
Alpha 40 Project website: http://www.users.uswest.net/~woody8
Superstition Spacemodeling Society: http://www.sssrocketry.org/
----------------------------------------------------------------

 
 
 

LOC Onyx advice

Post by Barry Lync » Sat, 20 May 2000 04:00:00


One mistake most folks make is to not sand off the glassine layer where the
fins meet the BT.  If you don't, the fins will not stay on.  If you do, the
fins will pull the BT apart before they break off.
Nice fillets are also required on this and other kits where the fins do not
extend through the wall.
If you fly on hard surfaces, use more chute.  In the Midwest corn fields the
supplied chute is plenty.

--
Barry E ***
NAR#76085 SR L2 TRA# 7961 L2
http://www.FoundCollection.com/~be***/

Quote:
> Just picked up an LOC Onyx kit.  First LOC kit I've seen without TTW fins.
> Any advice / tips from those who've built these before?

> Thanks,

> Rob
> --
> You'll have to remove the nonsense from
> my email address to use it...
> ****************


 
 
 

LOC Onyx advice

Post by Barry Lync » Sat, 20 May 2000 04:00:00


One more thing- Don't put an H180 in it without glassing it- pulled the fin
and paper off the thing.  Of course it was an easy repair but such a curly Q
flight!
Barry


Quote:
> Just picked up an LOC Onyx kit.  First LOC kit I've seen without TTW fins.
> Any advice / tips from those who've built these before?

> Thanks,

> Rob
> --
> You'll have to remove the nonsense from
> my email address to use it...
> ****************

 
 
 

LOC Onyx advice

Post by Robert Huggin » Sun, 21 May 2000 04:00:00


Just picked up an LOC Onyx kit.  First LOC kit I've seen without TTW fins.
Any advice / tips from those who've built these before?

Thanks,

Rob
--
You'll have to remove the nonsense from
my email address to use it...
****************

 
 
 

LOC Onyx advice

Post by BRMut » Sun, 21 May 2000 04:00:00


Hi,
  Simple.  Be prepared to glue the fins back on.  Really, try to attach them as
best you can.  Put some small holes or deep scratches where the fin attaches.
It will still break off if you use the supplied parachute.  I switched to an
18" and have had no problems since, except for motor failures (2) and nose cone
eye failures (1).  It's ugly but still flies well.

Fly straight and true!

MikeyR

 
 
 

LOC Onyx advice

Post by Jim Rutkows » Mon, 22 May 2000 04:00:00


I agree that my Onyx would be a danger to spectators but no more than
a 6'+ HPR. Not that that justifies it. I built it before I took into
account such safety issues. My design goal was simply to make the
stoutest rocket I could using the Onyx as base. It was flown, as are
all my rockets, privately, before being taken to a club launch with
spectators. Since it has always flown straight as a string and
completely successfully, except for the lawndart incident, pilot
error, I'm confident about flying it around folks, at least at the
concentrations and distances at our club launches.

I've seen quite a few hi velocity "cruise missles" tear across the
desert at club launches and I'd be humilitated if one of my rockets
did that. That's why I test privately.

I've flown the rocket on a G80 successfully and after I certify I plan
on testing it with a H Class motor, privately of course. Try that with
a stock Onyx!

I can't argue with safety, I would never fly a "iffy heavy" rocket
around other people, but I'm sure as hell going to build and fly them
by myself.

Using a little common sense, and making sure the damn thing balances
goes a looong way.

Jim Rutkowski
BAR
NAR Pending

On Sat, 20 May 2000 10:45:29 -0700, The Silent Observer

Quote:

>Not to revive a thread that died a few weeks ago, but doesn't it seem to
>you that a rocket that can survive a lawn dart undamaged is, perhaps, a
>little too durable to fly safely in the presence of spectators?  That
>sort of strength is unnecessary in a rocket as light as an Onyx; it just
>makes the rocket more lethal if something goes wrong.

>I've got a Spike that's original stock cardboard tube, 1/8" ply fins,
>and plastic nose, and it's plenty strong for flight -- but if it lawn
>darted, I'd most likely lose the nose cone entirely (crumpled beyond
>repair) and have to cut the bode at the forward centering ring -- and
>that's still a little too strong, IMO; the same rocket could have been
>built with Estes type BT-80 and a thinner nose, with bass or hard balsa
>fins, and not only weigh enough less to fly without notification (not to
>mention not needing nose weight), but still survive a G80 -- which is
>far more than enough motor for a rocket under a pound...


>> Rob,

>> I built mine with 1/16th G-10 TTW and added about 40g of lead to the
>> NC to balance it out. Sure I lost some altitude performance but WOW is
>> is it a strong rocket. It took a lawn dart from about 500' and was
>> undamaged. Yep, didn't hurt it a bit and it hit so hard the motor
>> casing was drivin into the  MMA and the MMA was driven into the
>> airframe. The desert is rock hard out here. It was an E-28 something I
>> had clogged the ejection port with O ring grease.

>> I also use 2 parachutes with the stock chute bringing down the NC and
>> about a 30" bringing down the airframe.

>> BTW I also soaked the BT with CA.

>> Good luck.

>> Jim Rutkowski
>> BAR
>> NAR Pending

>> On Sat, 20 May 2000 01:11:53 GMT, "Robert Huggins"

>> >Just picked up an LOC Onyx kit.  First LOC kit I've seen without TTW fins.
>> >Any advice / tips from those who've built these before?

>> >Thanks,

>> >Rob

 
 
 

LOC Onyx advice

Post by Jim Rutkows » Mon, 22 May 2000 04:00:00


Mine came with a 12". Waaaaay to small for hard ground landings even
built stock IMHO.

Jim Rutkowski
BAR
NAR Pending


Quote:

>I'm missing something here. Since when did the Onyx come with a
>parachute??
>The kit I bought several years ago came with a streamer.

>Scott Hamilton
>BAR #????
>Up, Up, and Away!!

 
 
 

LOC Onyx advice

Post by Alex Merica » Tue, 23 May 2000 04:00:00


From the advice I've seen so far I think some people are confusing the Onyx
with the Aura.  The Onyx is a 3" diameter rocket that looks almost identical
to Estes' Big Daddy, but LOC had it first.  The Onyx has a parachute and uses
through the wall tab fins (i.e. they don't extend all the way to the motor
mount).  The Aura has a streamer and surface mount fins.

I added fiberglass cloth to the fin fillets.  I also put a strip of fiberglass
inside the body tube for the epoxy to bond to.  Flown this way my Onyx has
been very reliable; no broken fins yet. (what was that cracking sound I just
heard?)

Quote:

> I'm missing something here. Since when did the Onyx come with a
> parachute??
> The kit I bought several years ago came with a streamer.

> Scott Hamilton
> BAR #????
> Up, Up, and Away!!

--
Alex Mericas
NAR 62956 Level 2
President, Austin Area Rocketry Group
 
 
 

LOC Onyx advice

Post by Jim Rutkows » Tue, 23 May 2000 04:00:00


Alex,

I built my Onyx just a couple of months ago. The fins were definately
surface mount. 3/32" ply I'm pretty sure. And the Estes Big Daddy is a
4 fin design while the Onyx is a 3. Slightly different shape also. The
Big Daddy is definately a TTW design, pretty much the entire root
chord passes thru.

Jim Rutkowski
BAR
NAR Pending

On Mon, 22 May 2000 07:54:41 -0500, Alex Mericas

Quote:

>From the advice I've seen so far I think some people are confusing the Onyx
>with the Aura.  The Onyx is a 3" diameter rocket that looks almost identical
>to Estes' Big Daddy, but LOC had it first.  The Onyx has a parachute and uses
>through the wall tab fins (i.e. they don't extend all the way to the motor
>mount).  The Aura has a streamer and surface mount fins.

>I added fiberglass cloth to the fin fillets.  I also put a strip of fiberglass
>inside the body tube for the epoxy to bond to.  Flown this way my Onyx has
>been very reliable; no broken fins yet. (what was that cracking sound I just
>heard?)


>> I'm missing something here. Since when did the Onyx come with a
>> parachute??
>> The kit I bought several years ago came with a streamer.

>> Scott Hamilton
>> BAR #????
>> Up, Up, and Away!!

 
 
 

LOC Onyx advice

Post by Alex Merica » Tue, 23 May 2000 04:00:00


Quote:

> I built my Onyx just a couple of months ago. The fins were definately
> surface mount.

Ah yes!  I was building a Forte around the same time.  The Onyx is surface
mount, the Forte TTW tabs.  But I did use fiberglass on the fillets of both.

--
Alex Mericas
NAR 62956 Level 2
President, Austin Area Rocketry Group

 
 
 

LOC Onyx advice

Post by Jim Rutkows » Tue, 23 May 2000 04:00:00


An excellent idea I plan on trying on a project or two down the line.

On Mon, 22 May 2000 10:52:54 -0500, Alex Mericas

Quote:

>mount, the Forte TTW tabs.  But I did use fiberglass on the fillets of both.

 
 
 

LOC Onyx advice

Post by Tom Binfor » Tue, 23 May 2000 04:00:00


Quote:

> I've flown the rocket on a G80 successfully and after I certify I plan
> on testing it with a H Class motor, privately of course. Try that with
> a stock Onyx!

Mine, completely stock, held up to a G208. (I never did see it again
though.)

Tom

 
 
 

LOC Onyx advice

Post by Jim Rutkows » Wed, 24 May 2000 04:00:00


Tom,

That's amazing! Your building techniques must be first-rate.

I've never heard of a G208, could you enlighten me?

Jim Rutkowski
BAR
NAR Pending

On Mon, 22 May 2000 19:38:01 -0400, Tom Binford

Quote:


>> I've flown the rocket on a G80 successfully and after I certify I plan
>> on testing it with a H Class motor, privately of course. Try that with
>> a stock Onyx!

>Mine, completely stock, held up to a G208. (I never did see it again
>though.)

>Tom

 
 
 

LOC Onyx advice

Post by Tom Binfor » Wed, 24 May 2000 04:00:00


Quote:

> Tom,

> That's amazing! Your building techniques must be first-rate.

> I've never heard of a G208, could you enlighten me?

The G208 was made by Ravenna Rocket Research. It was a 29 mm motor with
an 'all surface' burning grain. The grains had no inhibitor on the
outside so they burned from the ends, core, and OD. They usually made
fairly decent bombs, but when they worked, they were very impressive. I
lost the Onyx in 1989.

Tom

 
 
 

LOC Onyx advice

Post by Chuck Wald » Fri, 26 May 2000 04:00:00


You know, when Tom goes out to the pad everyone stops and watches.  We
do this for two reasons:

1.  The engine in the rocket is significantly more powerful than the
designer ever dreamed about.  A G208 in an Onyx?  A C10 in a
Gnome?!?!?!
2.  There is a good chance that is the last time we will ever see that
rocket.

It's always fun when Tom is around :-)

Chuck Walden