Bulk vs Bottle Aging

Bulk vs Bottle Aging

Post by Insprucegro » Mon, 23 Feb 2004 00:30:53



We all know the more time you allow the wine to develop, the better the
result.However, I only have so many carboys sitting around, and by bottling
some of them, I can start the "next generation".

So, is there a siginificant difference in the results between letting it bulk
age in the carboy, or does aging in the bottle do the more or less the same.
(These are red kits  for the most part, and one port).

 
 
 

Bulk vs Bottle Aging

Post by K.J.Kristians » Mon, 23 Feb 2004 03:30:46


Stored at the same temperature and conditions there should be no
difference. I have seen discussions pointing to the difference in air
exposure and liquid surface (total surface larger in bottles). But I
have never read any substantial arguments which can explain any
difference. maybe a test would be interesting?
Quote:

> We all know the more time you allow the wine to develop, the better the
> result.However, I only have so many carboys sitting around, and by bottling
> some of them, I can start the "next generation".

> So, is there a siginificant difference in the results between letting it bulk
> age in the carboy, or does aging in the bottle do the more or less the same.
> (These are red kits  for the most part, and one port).


 
 
 

Bulk vs Bottle Aging

Post by Tom » Mon, 23 Feb 2004 04:33:28



Quote:
> Stored at the same temperature and conditions there should be no
> difference. I have seen discussions pointing to the difference in air
> exposure and liquid surface (total surface larger in bottles). But I
> have never read any substantial arguments which can explain any
> difference. maybe a test would be interesting?

That's been done already.  The results show that wine in large format
bottles ages more slowly and gracefully than the same wine in small bottles.

Although the large bottles obviously have more surface area of glass than
small bottles, they offer less surface area per unit volume of contents
[wine].  Surface effects between the glass and wine may play a part in the
maturation of the latter, but that is unknown at this time.  Another effect
to consider is that large containers tend to buffer the effects of
temperature changes in the local environment [cellar].

Tom S

 
 
 

Bulk vs Bottle Aging

Post by Insprucegro » Mon, 23 Feb 2004 08:21:43


Quote:

>That's been done already.  The results show that wine in large format
>bottles ages more slowly and gracefully than the same wine in small bottles.

  Since  I need the carboys, I think I will let some of my kits age in bottles
then. Not sure I care if my port and a few cheap kits age "gracefully"--if they
age a little quicker in bottles, so much the better!
 
 
 

Bulk vs Bottle Aging

Post by Lum » Mon, 23 Feb 2004 14:28:44



Quote:
> We all know the more time you allow the wine to develop, the better the
> result.However, I only have so many carboys sitting around, and by
bottling
> some of them, I can start the "next generation".

> So, is there a siginificant difference in the results between letting it
bulk
> age in the carboy, or does aging in the bottle do the more or less the
same.
> (These are red kits  for the most part, and one port).

Most red wines require 6-12 months of aging to develop "bottle" bouquet
after the last exposure to oxygen, and wine is exposed to much air-oxygen
when it is bottled.  Bottle bouquet generally does not develop in wine
stored in bulk containers because of periodic exposures to air-oxygen.

lum

 
 
 

Bulk vs Bottle Aging

Post by Denis Marie » Sun, 29 Feb 2004 22:02:08


I have two carboys (23L) ready to be bottled. If I decide to prolong aging
in the carboys, should I leave the airlocks on or cap the carboys airtight.
I have noticed that after two months in the carboy the air lock on the white
wine is still releasing a bubble or two out every day.  Another thing is
should the wine be racked at scheduled intervals during bulk aging?


Quote:



> > We all know the more time you allow the wine to develop, the better the
> > result.However, I only have so many carboys sitting around, and by
> bottling
> > some of them, I can start the "next generation".

> > So, is there a siginificant difference in the results between letting it
> bulk
> > age in the carboy, or does aging in the bottle do the more or less the
> same.
> > (These are red kits  for the most part, and one port).

> Most red wines require 6-12 months of aging to develop "bottle" bouquet
> after the last exposure to oxygen, and wine is exposed to much air-oxygen
> when it is bottled.  Bottle bouquet generally does not develop in wine
> stored in bulk containers because of periodic exposures to air-oxygen.

> lum

 
 
 

Bulk vs Bottle Aging

Post by Dar » Sun, 29 Feb 2004 22:43:36


I keep a bung and airlock on my carboys during bulk aging.  And I will rack
during bulk aging if the wine drops a lot of sediment.
Darlene


Quote:
> I have two carboys (23L) ready to be bottled. If I decide to prolong aging
> in the carboys, should I leave the airlocks on or cap the carboys
airtight.
> I have noticed that after two months in the carboy the air lock on the
white
> wine is still releasing a bubble or two out every day.  Another thing is
> should the wine be racked at scheduled intervals during bulk aging?





> > > We all know the more time you allow the wine to develop, the better
the
> > > result.However, I only have so many carboys sitting around, and by
> > bottling
> > > some of them, I can start the "next generation".

> > > So, is there a siginificant difference in the results between letting
it
> > bulk
> > > age in the carboy, or does aging in the bottle do the more or less the
> > same.
> > > (These are red kits  for the most part, and one port).

> > Most red wines require 6-12 months of aging to develop "bottle" bouquet
> > after the last exposure to oxygen, and wine is exposed to much
air-oxygen
> > when it is bottled.  Bottle bouquet generally does not develop in wine
> > stored in bulk containers because of periodic exposures to air-oxygen.

> > lum

 
 
 

Bulk vs Bottle Aging

Post by Don » Wed, 03 Mar 2004 20:26:38


Quote:
> I have two carboys (23L) ready to be bottled. If I decide to prolong aging
> in the carboys, should I leave the airlocks on or cap the carboys airtight.
> I have noticed that after two months in the carboy the air lock on the white
> wine is still releasing a bubble or two out every day.  

Leave an airlock on them as the volume will change with
temperature and some people say a sealed carboy can even
burst. The level can swing in the neck of a 23l carboy
about 1 cm for each degree Celsius.

The bubbles could be the out gassing of the CO2, I've never
watched my bubble count after putting them into bulk aging.
Could it be an ML?

Don

 
 
 

Bulk vs Bottle Aging

Post by Denis Marie » Wed, 03 Mar 2004 20:48:18


Thanks to every one for the information.
Just how long would you age, in a glass carboy, wine made with concentrate.


Quote:
> > I have two carboys (23L) ready to be bottled. If I decide to prolong
aging
> > in the carboys, should I leave the airlocks on or cap the carboys
airtight.
> > I have noticed that after two months in the carboy the air lock on the
white
> > wine is still releasing a bubble or two out every day.

> Leave an airlock on them as the volume will change with
> temperature and some people say a sealed carboy can even
> burst. The level can swing in the neck of a 23l carboy
> about 1 cm for each degree Celsius.

> The bubbles could be the out gassing of the CO2, I've never
> watched my bubble count after putting them into bulk aging.
> Could it be an ML?

> Don

 
 
 

Bulk vs Bottle Aging

Post by Ray » Thu, 04 Mar 2004 01:47:08


Concentrates are very different from fresh fruit.  Many of the whites I like
you and I would not age them over a month or two.  I aged a Gewrztraminer
for 9 months and it became too mellow.  It was much better at one month.  I
have not made a red from concentrate that overly impressed me so I will let
someone else comment on it.

Ray


Quote:
> Thanks to every one for the information.
> Just how long would you age, in a glass carboy, wine made with
concentrate.



> > > I have two carboys (23L) ready to be bottled. If I decide to prolong
> aging
> > > in the carboys, should I leave the airlocks on or cap the carboys
> airtight.
> > > I have noticed that after two months in the carboy the air lock on the
> white
> > > wine is still releasing a bubble or two out every day.

> > Leave an airlock on them as the volume will change with
> > temperature and some people say a sealed carboy can even
> > burst. The level can swing in the neck of a 23l carboy
> > about 1 cm for each degree Celsius.

> > The bubbles could be the out gassing of the CO2, I've never
> > watched my bubble count after putting them into bulk aging.
> > Could it be an ML?

> > Don

 
 
 

Bulk vs Bottle Aging

Post by Denis Marie » Thu, 04 Mar 2004 21:41:23


I appreciate this chart.  Thanks for taking the time to send this
attachment.

Quote:
> Not exactly on topic but the attached file shows "Peak Aging" & "Shelf
Life"
> for kits from Wine Kitz, a Canadian u-brew company.    The point is better
> kits peak later & reds later than whites, surprise, surprise!



> > I have two carboys (23L) ready to be bottled. If I decide to prolong
aging
> > in the carboys, should I leave the airlocks on or cap the carboys
> airtight.
> > I have noticed that after two months in the carboy the air lock on the
> white
> > wine is still releasing a bubble or two out every day.  Another thing is
> > should the wine be racked at scheduled intervals during bulk aging?





> > > > We all know the more time you allow the wine to develop, the better
> the
> > > > result.However, I only have so many carboys sitting around, and by
> > > bottling
> > > > some of them, I can start the "next generation".

> > > > So, is there a siginificant difference in the results between
letting
> it
> > > bulk
> > > > age in the carboy, or does aging in the bottle do the more or less
the
> > > same.
> > > > (These are red kits  for the most part, and one port).

> > > Most red wines require 6-12 months of aging to develop "bottle"
bouquet
> > > after the last exposure to oxygen, and wine is exposed to much
> air-oxygen
> > > when it is bottled.  Bottle bouquet generally does not develop in wine
> > > stored in bulk containers because of periodic exposures to air-oxygen.

> > > lum