Aging, carboy vs. bottle...

Aging, carboy vs. bottle...

Post by Ted & Terry Meie » Tue, 17 Feb 1998 04:00:00



I have 2 five gallon carboys of cab. sauv. and 2 five gallon carboys of
lemberger in the ba***t.  Temperature at 59 degrees.  Primary and
secondary ferment went great and all racking is done.  Just clear red
wine with no signs of ferment.  I tried to add some sticks of oak that I
sawed 3/4" square.  After about 3 weeks started to taste a pitch taste
in one of the carboys, got scared and took all of the oak out.  I really
must stick to the oak chips made for this purpose.  After about 2 months
the pitch taste has relaxed and the wine seems that it will be OK.
Maybe even better when blended with the other Lemberger...  The question
is will the wine age faster in bottles or the 5 gallon carboys?  I have
heard the smaller the bottle the faster the ageing.  Is this the case or
not?  I am sure that I could bottle right now or leave in the carboys if
need be.  Please comment...

Ted Meier

 
 
 

Aging, carboy vs. bottle...

Post by Paul Frymie » Wed, 18 Feb 1998 04:00:00


All my books indicate that the smaller the bottle, the more rapid the
"aging".  I do not  have a thorough knowledge of what occurs during
aging, but one point most references make is that exposure to small
amounts of oxygen (like what would eventually diffuse through and around
a cork or what gets in the headspace when you bottle) is essential to
aging a wine, particularly a red.  One thing oxygen does, apparently, is
react with or otherwise bind tannin, mellowing a red wine.  It must have
other desired effects also, which I don't know about, but am looking for
a good book on (something like "The Chemistry of Winemaking" if I had to
guess a title).

Of course, my first 5 gallons is only 1 month old, so I can't speak from
experience.

 
 
 

Aging, carboy vs. bottle...

Post by E&/orM Wesso » Wed, 18 Feb 1998 04:00:00


Quote:

> On Mon, 16 Feb 1998 18:42:52 -0800, Ted & Terry Meier

> >The question
> >is will the wine age faster in bottles or the 5 gallon carboys?  I have
> >heard the smaller the bottle the faster the ageing.  Is this the case or
> >not?

> Wine does age faster in smaller quantities.  A few years ago I bottled
> a red blend in magnums (1.5 l), regular bottles, and splits.  The
> splits were drinkable within 6 months, the regulars in about 1 year,
> and the magnums around the 1-1/2 year mark.  (I believe that the
> timing of these, e.g., every 6 months, was coincidental and should not
> be used as a rule of thumb).

> >I am sure that I could bottle right now or leave in the carboys if
> >need be.  Please comment...

> When did you start the wines and are they fresh fruit or kit?  If
> fresh fruit I'd let the cabernet go at least 6 months before bottling,
> maybe as much as a year.  If it's a kit, you can probably bottle at
> any time.

> I don't know anything about lemberger so I can't offer any advice on
> it.
> ---
> Bryan

> for more info check out the rec.crafts.winemaking
> FAQ:  http://www.pobox.com/~malak/rcw.faq

Following on what Brian recommended, if it is fresh fruit and you want
to bulk-age make sure you keep the sulfite level up to 50 ppm or you
will find a white scum forms on the surface , This is usually bacterial
and will spoil the wine. Proper sulfite levels will definitely inhibit
this growth (mycodermia?) One-half teaspoon per 5 gal potassium sulfite
will usually do the job.
 
 
 

Aging, carboy vs. bottle...

Post by Bryan Fazek » Thu, 19 Feb 1998 04:00:00


On Mon, 16 Feb 1998 18:42:52 -0800, Ted & Terry Meier

Quote:

>The question
>is will the wine age faster in bottles or the 5 gallon carboys?  I have
>heard the smaller the bottle the faster the ageing.  Is this the case or
>not?

Wine does age faster in smaller quantities.  A few years ago I bottled
a red blend in magnums (1.5 l), regular bottles, and splits.  The
splits were drinkable within 6 months, the regulars in about 1 year,
and the magnums around the 1-1/2 year mark.  (I believe that the
timing of these, e.g., every 6 months, was coincidental and should not
be used as a rule of thumb).

Quote:
>I am sure that I could bottle right now or leave in the carboys if
>need be.  Please comment...

When did you start the wines and are they fresh fruit or kit?  If
fresh fruit I'd let the cabernet go at least 6 months before bottling,
maybe as much as a year.  If it's a kit, you can probably bottle at
any time.

I don't know anything about lemberger so I can't offer any advice on
it.
---
Bryan

for more info check out the rec.crafts.winemaking
FAQ:  http://www.pobox.com/~malak/rcw.faq

 
 
 

Aging, carboy vs. bottle...

Post by Mark Hedi » Thu, 19 Feb 1998 04:00:00


Quote:


> > On Mon, 16 Feb 1998 18:42:52 -0800, Ted & Terry Meier

> > >The question
> > >is will the wine age faster in bottles or the 5 gallon carboys?  I have
> > >heard the smaller the bottle the faster the ageing.  Is this the case or
> > >not?
> > ---
> > Bryan

> > for more info check out the rec.crafts.winemaking
> > FAQ:  http://www.pobox.com/~malak/rcw.faq
> Following on what Brian recommended, if it is fresh fruit and you want
> to bulk-age make sure you keep the sulfite level up to 50 ppm or you
> will find a white scum forms on the surface , This is usually bacterial
> and will spoil the wine. Proper sulfite levels will definitely inhibit
> this growth (mycodermia?) One-half teaspoon per 5 gal potassium sulfite
> will usually do the job.

In my experience, 1/2 teaspoon per five gallons is twice as much sulfite
as needed, and may ruin the nose of the wine.
- Mark
 
 
 

Aging, carboy vs. bottle...

Post by Desmond Pow » Thu, 19 Feb 1998 04:00:00



Quote:

>Wine does age faster in smaller quantities.  A few years ago I bottled
Snip
>When did you start the wines and are they fresh fruit or kit?  If
>fresh fruit I'd let the cabernet go at least 6 months before bottling,
>maybe as much as a year.  If it's a kit, you can probably bottle at

If this is the case, then what is the purpose of leaving a fresh fuit
wine in the carboy for extended periods of time.  There are a few
reasons I can think of off the top of my head including
 - clearing
 - ML fermentation
 - to leave the wine on the lees for different flavour
   characteristics.  

Other than these, are there any other reasons?

Des Power

reply to des at thezone dot net.

 
 
 

Aging, carboy vs. bottle...

Post by Bryan Fazek » Thu, 19 Feb 1998 04:00:00


On Tue, 17 Feb 1998 19:06:31 -0800, E&/orM Wesson

Quote:

>Following on what Brian recommended, if it is fresh fruit and you want
>to bulk-age make sure you keep the sulfite level up to 50 ppm or you
>will find a white scum forms on the surface , This is usually bacterial
>and will spoil the wine. Proper sulfite levels will definitely inhibit
>this growth (mycodermia?) One-half teaspoon per 5 gal potassium sulfite
>will usually do the job.

I think you have your measurement wrong.  1/2 tsp potassium
metabisulfite will produce ~120 ppm in 5 gallons.
---
Bryan

for more info check out the rec.crafts.winemaking
FAQ:  http://www.pobox.com/~malak/rcw.faq

 
 
 

Aging, carboy vs. bottle...

Post by Bryan Caspe » Sat, 21 Feb 1998 04:00:00


Quote:

> If this is the case, then what is the purpose of leaving a fresh fuit
> wine in the carboy for extended periods of time.  There are a few
> reasons I can think of off the top of my head including
>  - clearing
>  - ML fermentation
>  - to leave the wine on the lees for different flavour
>    characteristics.

> Other than these, are there any other reasons?

One additional reason would be to have a more even batch of wine, i.e..
each bottle in the batch would be similar in taste since the first part of
the aging process was together rather than separately in bottles.

Bryan Casper